“Can men and women be friends?”
What made the film “When Harry Met Sally” memorable for me — aside from the “orgasm” of Sally (Meg Ryan) at the diner — was this intriguing question, provoked by Harry’s premise/presupposition that men and women cannot be simply friends because sex almost always enters the equation.
(In another movie, I think “All of Me,” Steve Martin gets confronted by his wife — “I faked all my orgasms!” — who proceeded to demonstrate this by having “one” right in front of him in his very office. Steve Martin, humiliated, replies, “Well, so did I!”)
Of course, as Harry (Billy Crystal) grows and matures in the course of the years, he revises and modifies his theory but basically retains the core of his presupposition.
Men are basically pigs. Men will (almost always) want to have sex with an attractive woman. Friend or foe.
Towards the end of the movie, Harry admits to, “for the first time in his life,” being simply friends with an attractive woman (Sally). And his best friend says that he’s crazy.
The movie ultimately (and perhaps unwittingly) proves Harry’s point, because Harry doesn’t end up having a “platonic” friendship with Sally. Depending on how you look at it, he gets more than what he bargained for.
Men and women (who find each other attractive) cannot become or remain friends. Because sooner or later, sex (the young Harry) or romantic love (the mature Harry), rears its ugly/pretty head.
Taking this as a serious question, is it really possible to have a “disinterested” friendship with someone (man or woman) one finds to be sexually/romantically attractive?
Does sexual relations (let’s not even talk of “making love”) with a “friend” necessarily complicate matters, resulting in the end of friendship?
If we go back to the Greek conception of friendship and love (as “eros,” as desire), women can be the object of desire, but they cannot become “friends.” (For the ancient Greeks, friendship can only take place between equals, and to them, men and women are not equals.)
Nietzsche claims in “Thus Spoke Zarathustra” that, so far, women have only been capable of loving. They haven’t been capable of friendship, yet.
And yet, more often than not, it would be women, more than men, who would readily speak of being capable of having and maintaining “platonic, disinterested friendships.”
Hmmm…
best regards,
egalitar-ian
Tags: Friendship, Gender Issues, Love, When Harry Met Sally
hahahahah…I agree…sabi nga ng best friend ko “Ang fubu ay fubu lang, ang friend ay friend, pag pinagsama ang dalawa, relasyon na ito”
btw…dentista ka na ba? bakit ka may dental chair sa website?
so ano ka ba talaga ha????
btw, baka yung dental chair e isang indikasyon na kelangan mo ng paayos ang pustiso mo hahahaha
Hindi ba barber’s chair yan?
Anyway, am posting good friend and enlightened being Annamari’s comment on that post in autograffiti years ago.
best regards,
ian
——
AnnaMari’s reply:
Good news: The answer is yes, men and women can be friends…
So, on to friendship, sex and friendship after sex.
Yes, men and women can be friends. The quality of one’s friendships also depends on how one looks at sex. My question is, why should sex and friendship be mutually exclusive? Yeah, yeah, I know, there are complications, and I am perfectly aware of that.
When I was a child and on to my teen years, I’ve always had more male than female friends. Perhaps it was because I was more comfortable with them, having two brothers before me. I just couldn’t relate to females. That all changed however after college, and I just found myself drawn to more female energies. All these friendships were beautiful in their own way.
I’d like to tell you about a wonderful 20 year old friendship that you can say began as a powerful attraction. A few years ago, and after seeing each other through various personal crises, fights, spiritual and practical projects, lots and lots of relationship problems (with other men/women of course) my friend and I were having a quiet moment and he looked at me and said, “I’m really glad we got the sex out of the way early enough…”
And yes, he was right! What we had gone through as friends all these years -the tampuhan, the strange loyalty, the craziness, the unyielding support, and that intimate knowledge of one another that allowed us to give each other the right advice in dealing with a relationship problem – was possible only because we had been brave and daring enough to admit the attraction, act on it(safely and responsibly of course) and maturely realize that it was NOT what we wanted!
Of course it was not a simple jump from bed to friendship, but as in all relationships that path is not all straightforward. And because, yes because, the sexual curiosity had been taken care of early enough, we were able to go from “lovestruck” to oh, “we’d be better off as friends, I think we’d get more done and be of better service to the world and our other friends.”
I say it all depends on your definition(s) of sex, I guess. I’ve had the grace of having among my friends ex-lovers. They are good friends and up to now I trust them as I would my wonderful female friends. Early on I promised myself that I would never undress for anyone to whom I could not bare my soul as well. Why go to bed with anyone who cannot be your friend? (Of course, I am not discounting the fact that there is some thrill for other people to have sex with someone they do not like… But I guess that’s not for me)
Life is too short to waste on making enemies with people who know how your belly button looks like. I’m not saying either that all ex-lovers have become my great pals (some of them have been good enough to stay out of my life) but I don’t harbor any ill feelings for them, either. Friendship is important. Sex shouldn’t get in the way of a fulfilling life-time relationship with another human being. So it all starts with how you treat yourself and others as sexual beings. With respect.
Peace